63: Moms Like Us: An Interview with Cindy Decker

You are listening to episode 63 of The Autism Mom Coach. Moms Like Us: Interview with Cindy Decker.

Welcome to The Autism Mom Coach podcast, I am your host, Lisa Candera. I am a lawyer, a life coach, and most importantly, I am the full-time single mother of a teenager with Autism and other comorbid diagnoses. I know what it is like to wonder if you are doing enough or the right things for your child and to live in fear of their future.

I also know that constantly fueling yourself with fear and anxiety is not sustainable for you or of any benefit to your child. That is why in this podcast I will share practical strategies and tools you can use to shift from a chronic state of fight, flight to some calm and ease. You are your childs greatest resource, lets take care of you.

Hello everyone. We are going to end Autism Awareness Month with my conversation with Cindy Decker. Cindy is a former client and now lifelong friend who I had the privilege of coaching for six months. Cindy came to our coaching relationship at her self-described rock bottom following the pandemic. And in this episode she shares the three things she learned and implemented from our time coaching together and how these three things have changed the way she shows up as an Autism parent.

Cindy is a great example of how investing in your own wellness not only impacts you, it impacts your child, your family, and your community. Now that Cindy is not spending her precious time spinning in worry and catastrophizing, she has made room for more joy and the very important work of advocating for her child and other children through a state-wide advocacy program that she will tell you about. With that, lets talk to Cindy.

Lisa: Cindy, welcome to the podcast. I am so excited to have you here and Im so happy for my listeners to hear from you and to learn about your experiences. Please introduce yourself and tell the audience about your Autism journey.

Cindy: Thanks, Lisa. I appreciate you having me on the podcast. My name is Cindy Decker. I started my Autism journey with my youngest son. I have three sons, let me start with that. I have a 21 year old in college. I have an 18 year old headed to college, so is neurotypical. And then we have an 11 year old who is on the Autism spectrum. He was diagnosed at age four so we are on the seventh year of this journey. And honestly, when we started with Liam, we noticed challenges from the beginning.

I had two other children so we noticed things just when he was little, sensory issues and just how he behaved in public and struggles that he had when we were at his brothers football games and events at school, daycare. So we went through eight different daycares before the age of three.

Lisa: Wow.

Cindy: Yeah, we went through eight different daycares before he turned three. And so we knew there was something going on but we just had not enough knowledge and because hes the youngest we were often told, Well, hes the baby, his brothers are speaking for him. Mom is speaking for him. Hes your baby so youre babying him. And so we went through that until finally at aged three we found a pediatrician who would actually listen. And immediately he said, I very clearly remember that day we sat in his office for a 15 minute evaluation to get a referral.

And Liam was climbing over me and turning on and off the light. And he said, Dont be afraid when they tell you its autism. And I had gone in for an ADHD diagnosis.

Lisa: Thats not what I came for.

Cindy: That was not, what do you mean, dont be afraid? What are you talking about? So we did, we went for the evaluation, got through the evaluation. That evaluation sent us to a neurologist. And the neurologist said, Okay, were going to go through the Autism diagnosis. And I was like, Yeah, you know, I dont think so. And so I put him off for a year. And at age four we went back for a follow-up with him and he was like, So about that test that youve canceled twice, we need to do a diagnosis. You need to be able to get him the right services at school.

At that point we only had the ADHD diagnosis. And he said, Miss Decker, why dont you want to do the test? Why have you canceled it twice? And I said, I just dont know. I dont see Autism. Ive seen it from what Ive seen on TV. And he very gently chuckled at me and very gently said, Well, were going to do the test and lets see where it goes. And so thats what we did, we did the AdAS and it came back with an Autism diagnosis. And thats when we went back to the school.

He was already getting services at that point, Liam was already at that point in preschool and the preschool special needs program at school. And we were still seeing struggles. So we went back to the school before he started kindergarten. And we had an Autism diagnosis, lets walk through kindergarten fully aware of what were needing. And thats when our battle with the school started. Because at that point Liam had words. He wasnt super communicative and he didnt have, he had a speech delay. We knew he had a language processing disorder.

Thats when the school pushed back and said, Well, hes not Autistic. Were not giving the Autism diagnosis in school. Because in school that meant 11 other services that comes with Autism. In Texas theres an Autism Texas supplement. And so theyre like, Hes got the services, were going to give him what he needs. Were going to put in a generic classroom. Hes going to share an aid with five other students and were going to be fine. And so our school journey began with that.

Lisa: Wow. So just take us back to when you eventually did get the AdAS completed and it came back indicating an Autism diagnosis. Did you believe it or what was your reaction to it at that point?

Cindy: Its funny looking back to it because we had, here in Houston we had a little hurricane called Harvey. That was the worst flood that Houston had ever seen. We did not directly get affected. We couldnt leave our house for a week but we did not get flooded thankfully. But everybody around us had gotten flooded, and even getting to, they did the testing and we went back a week after the hurricane to get the result. It took us two hours to get to the doctor. There was still areas underwater. We still couldnt get there.

The diagnostician, we waited in the office for two hours because the diagnostician couldnt get to the office to give us the result. So the physicians assistant had to come in and give us the diagnosis. So I think by the time she walked in to read us the result, we were so numb from what had just happened that week and what it had taken to get there. And the two hours that we had waited in the office, that honestly, she just read it and I was numb. It was almost like listening to somebody else talking. And I could hear her words but they just werent sinking in.

At that point it was like, okay, give me the paperwork. Ill call the school. In my head I was in action mode, lets get something done, Im not listening. So I didnt let it sink in. I think under different circumstances I probably would have felt it more. But I literally just grabbed the paper, walked out the door and called the school on the way home in the car. So lets get wheels in motion, I have an answer, lets get going. And it took a good probably a good year, maybe even several years, Lisa, for it to really sink in on what we were up against and what that meant.

And we went through a really rough patch soon after that where it really sank in of, okay, my child is on the Autism spectrum, this is what it means. This is a lifelong thing. This isnt just about getting him the services at school, its how am I going to help him in life. And it just threw me, once it hit probably a year or two years later it really sent me into a path thats actually how I got to you. Because at that point I was so worn and so just done and kind of depression over it. It just sank in later.

It didnt sink in as they were reading it to me. I was hearing it but it was almost like an out of body experience but I think it was all the events leading up to that day that made it harder.

Lisa: Yeah, I totally remember the diagnosis and the out of body experience, thinking, theyre just going to tell me its a speech delay. And then they say, Autism. But Im like, okay, thats fine because Autism needs services. This was in my brain at the time. But then the doctor took me aside and gave me a pamphlet and she said, I know hes your first child, I dont know if youre thinking about having more children. And then she gave me some sort of statistic about the indications in other children.

And I just remember feeling like time had stopped, I could not process anything at that point because it was like, youve diagnosed my child and now youre diagnosing prospective children as well and anyhow. But I also like you, went into the go, go, go mode of doing as much as possible as fast as possible. And I think that that is so common for so many of us. And there comes a point where we look up and were just like, how did we get here? Feeling so overwhelmed, not even recognizing ourselves or our lives.

Cindy: Yeah, that is exactly how that went. It was suddenly here I am and now what do I do? Its not just about having the paperwork and having the answer, is this is going to be a lifetime of how do we help him and give him the right services for life?

Lisa: Yeah, absolutely. Well, Cindy, its so hard for me to believe that it is almost three years since we first met. Can you share a bit about how you found me and why you decided to reach out for coaching?

Cindy: Yeah. So yeah, we were in the middle of the pandemic. At this point Liam had been in a self-contained classroom. Lets see, he was put into a self-contained classroom in first grade. And mind you, this was our third elementary school, so remember, eight daycares, third elementary school. By age eight he had hit his third elementary school. And so the pandemic hit and we had been in this self-contained classroom for a little over nine months and then the world blew up. So by that fall he was back in school.

When the pandemic hit in March he went back to school probably about September, but I was at my lowest point. Im a full-time working mom. I am an executive with a company. And my older children were at that time, Ethan, he was a senior year, the pandemic hit on his senior year. And then I had a freshman in high school. So working through how do you deal with a senior year pandemic when your child is now missing prom and senior pictures and graduations. And all that goes with that spring.

And luckily he had finished his football season intact, but still, going through that senior spring and then a freshman in high school going through the pandemic at the same time that Liam had been out of school. And I was probably at my lowest point. And I saw you comment I think on a post on [inaudible], thats how I found you. I saw you make a comment, Im like, Thats a really smart thing to say. And so I kind of Googled you and found you. And through finding you I connected with you.

And I know you remember this but when I connected with you, you set up a call with me. And I had Josh sit with me because I knew that my husband, although very supportive, was going to struggle with, Well, youre going to see a coach but youre not going to see a therapist.

Lisa: Whats this all about?

Cindy: Yeah. Why are you doing that? Go call a therapist. And I knew I needed something. I knew I needed one or the other, I just didnt know what your coaching was about and so I called you first.

Lisa: Im so glad.

Cindy: Yeah, me too. I remember we sat at the kitchen table and listened. And we talked through. We told you everything that was going on and walked through the process and your coaching model and what you do and how you work with people. And when the call was over, Josh was like, Well? Im like, I have to do this. I said, You dont understand, I have to do this. If its six months, if its six weeks, I have to do this. I said, And I really liked Lisa. I could relate to you.

There was so many times where were in this world in Autism where we dont 100% fit in all the time. We have that child who is considered high functioning, who can speak but doesnt communicate. And were working moms, so were trying to hold down this full-time job at a high executive level and trying to just keep it all in balance. I thought, I need somebody who understands that. I cant just find a therapist who does all of that. And I knew you did all of them.

Lisa: Yeah, I so remember our intake call so well, especially you and Josh sitting side by side at the table. And I was really struck by how similar the experiences we were having, just at different timeframes. Our sons are a few years apart but they are both what is considered high functioning mostly I think because they can speak but thats not really our experience of them. Can you talk a little bit about that as it pertains to Liam?

Cindy: Yeah. So like you said, they can speak and Liam is a very chatty person. And part of the reason why I didnt understand why we wanted to do an Autism diagnosis is Liam is also social. He wants to fit in. Hes just socially awkward. The things that come out of his mouth, we laugh now but there was times when we just wanted to crawl under the table for the way he would just tell somebody. And its like you said, its that high functioning until hes just not functioning.

And when hes not functioning it can be destructive. It can be hurtful because hes just going through the emotions of getting out what he wants to say in a setting that is just, it doesnt fit in with what he needs at the moment. So its a really hard thing when I feel like in the Autism spectrum, when you can speak but you cant say what you want to say. That communication is just not coming out right. Or youre feeling the emotion, for Liam its a lot of the emotion. When he gets embarrassed it immediately makes him mad because he doesnt understand what the embarrassment is.

Or if hes sad he doesnt want to feel sad so then he fights against it with anger. And so understanding his emotions was a really big part of it. And like you said, I think thats where you and I really bonded, because like Ben, a lot of the things that I tell you, he does this. Youre like, Ben did that and this is what we [crosstalk]. So it was finding that person that understood. And he may communicate with you but he loves curse words.

Lisa: Who doesnt?

Cindy: Right. And in that moment, Ill even give you an example, this was hilarious. So a couple of weeks ago, Liam does go to a therapist and we were leaving the therapists, So were going to go to dinner. Daddys going to meet us at dinner. And it was a restaurant we hadnt been to before which was going to be hard for us but we thought wed try. And we walk in and as you walk in the restaurant, its a really small restaurant and the bars right there and its happy hour and it was loud and people were laughing and having a happy hour.

And Liam immediately walked in and yelled out a curse word and it was like the needle scratch on the record player. The whole restaurant was silent. It was like, Okay, were here.

Lisa: Weve arrived.

Cindy: Weve arrived, can I have a table now, please? So thats what high functioning, where everybody is like, Well, he can communicate so well. And the key is he can speak really well, he cant always communicate really well.

Lisa: Yeah. I have such a similar experience with Ben especially around the emotions. If he feels shame or embarrassment or that hes being called out for something, his reaction to that can be really severe because I think for him ,he experienced it that physically, its such an intense emotion and then hes also fighting it as well.

Cindy: Exactly. Thats exactly how it goes. Its a physical, yeah, their emotions are physical I think for them more than anything.

Lisa: Yeah. I mean I think about everything else that they experience, turned up to a 10 and so all the sensory issues and things like that, if that also goes for the emotions that they are feeling, that its just such an intense feeling. I mean I know for me when I feel certain emotions like fear or worry, I want to get away from them as well. And so just maybe not really understanding whats happening and then theyre reacting to it as well.

Cindy: Agree.

Lisa: Cindy, we worked together for six months. Can you tell us what your biggest takeaways or lessons learned were from our time together?

Cindy: Oh gosh, I have so many. I think we started our session and one of the first things that you taught me is that its not personal. Everything Liam did I took personally. If he reacted a certain way its because I wasnt a good enough mom or because I taught him wrong or because I didnt do something. So that was probably my biggest one. And then I would probably say the other two that I learned from you was catastrophizing. I still do it, dont get me wrong, we still have moments. Weve had a rough couple of weeks at school lately.

And immediately Im like, The worlds ending. Were going to have to leave school forever. And so I still do it but I catch myself doing it now. Its okay, pause, take a breath. What are you thinking? Why are you reacting this way? So I kind of walk myself through your process. And just the fact too, my third big learning from you was I am the expert. I would always, my biggest answer to things especially with school was why are they doing this? They know better, and I told them this is an issue for Liam. If theyre the expert, why cant they fix it? And learning that Im the expert. I know him.

Somebody else I think recently and I cant think of who it was so Im sorry if Im not giving credit to the right person but they said that they were the only fixed set person in their IEP meetings every year. Everybody on the team at some point or another, shifts changes, moods changes. Youre the one fixed person in the IEP meeting year after year after year. And so you had also taught me, Im the expert and thats why. Im the one whos there every year and Ive been through the three different elementary schools, now four because we moved last July.

Im the one who went through the eight different daycares and the different ABA therapist and the different speech therapist. And so Im the one whos seen his reaction and his world evolve. So now I know Im the expert. So when somebody says, Well, were doing this and its not working. I dont go, Well, youre the expert, fix it. I go, Well, heres what Ive tried at home, lets try this. Or how does this work? What if you do this? Or this is what I see from this situation.

And it has made me a much better partner I think in IEP meetings with the team because Ive been able to work with them, not expecting them to come up with a solution.

Lisa: Wow, thats so powerful. I remember, we spent a lot of time on the expert. And youre like, Well, they have training. Im like, Well, how much training do you think they actually have compared to your 11 years of 24 hour training? Not to dismiss training and being a professional but when you are living this every day and over time periods and you are the constant, we really are the expert. We of course benefit from bringing other people onto the team and relying on them and conferring with them.

But I think its such a mistake for us to believe, well, were just the mom. Were so much more than that.

Cindy: Right, yeah, just understanding that. I think that was probably my biggest eye opener after the its not personal, stop taking things personally. But yeah, just understanding that, yes, I was not trained in occupational therapy. No, I was not trained as a psychologist or a psychiatrist or a [inaudible] of any kind. Im not an educator, Im an economist by trade, but understanding that Ive seen in motion what works for Liam. And I can see when hes dysregulated, I can see it in his face. I can see it 30 minutes before the meltdown will happen. Oh, oh, were in trouble.

Ive got to right this train or were going to derail here in a minute. And so learning that, knowing that I can see it coming and explaining that to people of, Heres some signs that you can look for. Heres what might cause this. Or we had a challenge at school last week and immediately I sent a note to the school, Well, heres what I think happened. Heres what I see. So just a heads up, you didnt see it but this is probably what led to it. Our kiddos have these challenges, its not just because they want to.

And when you and I met I would get a lot of, Well, hes attention seeking. And that I took personal. When people tell me hes doing things, attention seeking, I was like, Well, hes not just a brat whos trying to get your attention. And now Ive realized that hes attention seeking because hes trying to get your reaction or your emotions going because hes trying to communicate something to you. So yes, it is attention seeking but not in, Im a brat, I raised him the wrong way. Its attention seeking in that hes trying to communicate something to get your attention to help him move on.

And I think working with you for those six months helped me see the difference between the, youre a brat, attention seeking versus youre attention seeking to communicate something to help him move on. That to me was the biggest breakthrough that I had.

Lisa: Yeah, I think that that is such an important piece because what I say about behaviors is that when we take it personally we make it personal. So you make it about your child, hes a brat. You make it about yourself, youre not a good enough mother, youre too permissive. You make it about your parenting and all of that just serves to escalate your stress, undermine your self-confidence as a parent. And neither of those serves you or your child. And so that reframe for me has been so big.

And even with my clients who are like, No, well, its personal because he said, I hate you, to me. And its like, well, okay, lets just say it is personal. If that was an actual truth that we can have and we cant, is it helpful to think that? Because its not because it just makes you more aggravated at them, more aggravated at yourself. And so its like were reframing these things for ourselves is just to notice, how are we showing up when were believing its personal? And how is that impacting us? Because thats the piece that we can change before we get to trying to change our kid.

Because were all trying to do that in some way. We think if they just did or do this, then I would feel better. And we really need to do the work to support ourselves because try as we might we cant control these little guys or big guys as they do become as they grow. So, Cindy, its been about two years since our coaching relationship ended, although our friendship is going strong. Can you share how you can continue to use what you learned during our six months in your day-to-day life?

Cindy: So I still, these three things I think are the three that I use every single day. When I get that call from school and my whole body tenses up and immediately Im like, This is it. This is the call that gets him out of school. Ive stopped doing that. Ill see the calls come in and be like, Hi, whats going on? Now, it does help that the school immediately calls and says, Theres nothing, he just forgot his snack.

Lisa: When they call me, theyre like, Hi, how are you doing? Im like, No small talk, lets get right to it.

Cindy: They immediately start with, Hi, its Suzie Q and theres nothing wrong. But I use that, to answer the phone, I calm myself first and say, He just needs a snack, its okay. When that situation happens at home where hes dysregulated and struggling at the moment, the not taking it personal, I just reiterate that to myself every day. Its not personal. I am the expert. I know better. So that I wont start madly Googling the resolution to a problem that weve already been through. Ive already done it.

As they get older, to me its the same problems. Theyre just a little bit bigger because the emotions are bigger. So it doesnt make it easier but it does in some way because weve been through it. And so thats how I think youve helped me is that every day Im constantly [inaudible] that wasnt personal. And Ill just repeat these phrases, its not personal, pause, think. Okay, think through it so that you can think, what are you thinking, how am I thinking it before I react to it. And Im not perfect at it by any stretch, but that has really helped me over the last few years.

Just continuously I guess, practicing that pause and thinking, okay, what am I thinking, what really happened and how am I going to react to it, thats not going to set him off. Im on a much even keel with him. I might say to my husband however, because although he listened to all of our coaching calls [inaudible]. But thats how it has helped me, it really just, okay, how am I going to stay even keel for this and not react to drive his reaction or elevate him to the next level.

Lisa: Yeah. No, that makes so much sense. And part of what youre saying is practicing those thoughts, one of the things that I teach in my coaching program that I taught you, its not enough just to say, its not personal like a mantra. Because if you dont believe it and it doesnt feel differently in your body, its just words that youre saying that are meaningless to you. But we coached for so long on it that that shift became real for you. You do believe that its not personal. And when you believe that, it feels differently than feeling like it is or hes doing it on purpose or youre a bad mom.

And its that combination of believing that thought and having that emotional shift that enables you to show up in the way that you want to, which is such an important thing.

Cindy: Yeah, that is not personal, it carries in so many ways throughout this because like I said, people will tell you, Well, hes attention seeking. And immediately thats personal. And so working through that and how Im thinking about it and what Im thinking about it, when I hear it is how do I help him get through that emotion and through that attention seeking moment to, again, go through it without further emotions or further escalation? And that was a hard one for us I think when you and I started working together.

I just think it immediately, okay, stop on your thought, get out of your mindset and figure out to help him through this and not just get upset over it, if that helps.

Lisa: Okay. Cindy, I want to shift a bit to what has opened up for you in terms of your capacity and your mental space now that you are not constantly beating yourself up, second guessing yourself and taking Liams behaviors, personally. As I recall, midway through our work you got involved in some very important policy work, can you tell us about that?

Cindy: Yeah. So being able to understand my emotions and how I was working through the emotions as Liam was going through his emotions really helped me first of all give myself some space. I was able to get my health back in check. I was able to get back to working out, find the right nutrition plan form that worked at the time. And those were all things that I had let go of. I also have been able to, I took a class, so I joined an organization here in Texas and theyre all over the country, some states have it, some states dont, but its called Partners in Policymaking.

And so I signed up for the Partners in Policymaking class and went through six months of learning about policy and bills and writing bills and understanding how to speak to our politicians. And so I was able to do all of that and then get involved with my state representative. And here are some bills that are important to me. Here are some things that its important for our kids, not just in education but in the community that should happen within this state.

And actually just recently about three weeks ago, I was able to go to the state capital and testify in front of a committee for safety regulations within the school for our kids when theyre struggling or having a meltdown against physical restraint in Texas. And so being able to understand that I am the expert and understanding that its not my fault, its not about me, its about them and how we help them, helped me to realize how could I testify in front of the capital. That yes, my child is struggling and when dysregulated can have just physical reactions to things.

But how can we as a country, as a state, as a community, help them with these things and putting the safety regulations in place so that they can self-regulate without a restraint. And so that really has helped me become a better advocate I think at a different level than just being the mom. And work again, meeting with state representatives and meeting with state senators on, Hey guys, here are some of the shortfalls that we have in the state that we really need to fix.

And Ive learned now as the expert that I can speak about it without thinking, I dont know, Im not the expert because I didnt study that. I can actually speak to it because I am the expert, Ive done it with my son. Heres my story and this is how we can help him.

Lisa: Thats so powerful. And the fact that you are currently raising your child, raising three children but currently raising Liam and have a big fancy pants job with lots of responsibilities. And then doing that work is just really amazing and so fortunate to have a mom like you with your experience to be in that position. Because I think it takes a really unique person to not just speak out for their own child but then to speak out for all children. Its at a higher level and its just amazing that youre doing that.

Cindy: Thank you. Im pretty proud of what weve accomplished so far. And theres a lot to do. Texas is a big state. But I think theres so much that we can do as the experts and as the parents who see this firsthand. Its funny, when I went to speak at congress last week and I gave my testimony, the committee chair actually grabbed me afterwards and was like, I learned so much from you. And there was people testifying who are experts, the head of The Autism Society and the head of this organization and all these things.

And she said, I have learned a lot from you because you gave us firsthand knowledge of what youve been through. And I thought, well, this is [33:08] is all about. I am not the head of the work solutions organization but here I am telling you what we have experienced.

Lisa: Well, its funny and I did a podcast episode about this just to sort of lighten it up, What Is An Expert and this was really inspired by you because you were really insistent with me, These people went to four years of education or maybe eight years of education. And well, what makes someone an expert? Is it because they took classes? Is it because they had a couple of different experiences in different settings?

And the example that I used in the podcast episode was from my cousin Vinny where [inaudible] Mona Lisa to be an expert because she worked in her dads mechanic shop and so she knew the hum of every car, whatever it was. But thats the point, you dont have to have the formal education to be an expert in something. So, Cindy, this work is all really incredible and Im sure there are people who are interested in learning more about it. So if they wanted to do that, how would they find you and to learn more?

Cindy: So you can always reach out to me @autismwithyourshirtoff. I have that on Instagram and on Facebook, just send me a DM and I can answer any questions you have and Ill respond.

Lisa: Well, thank you so much for joining the podcast. I know that people really benefited from your experiences and from the stories that you had to share. I will just ask you for the parent who just got the diagnosis or their child just got kicked out of their first or second daycare or their first or second elementary school, what advice would you give to that parent?

Cindy: I would say, dont take it personal. Its not personal. Education is such a tricky subject. Its so cookie cutter per se that when they get a child who has a disability or is on the Autism spectrum and its hard for them to fit into that, its like that round hole fitting into the square peg or vice versa. So I would just say, take a minute, find Lisa, because you really, really helped me, exactly those three things. I cant even tell you enough how much it helped me to really stop and think about why Im the expert, how I know what I know is going to help the school system.

But take a moment and find your resource, there are so many ways, listening to your podcast. I listen to your podcast all the time. And Ill text you, Hey, I love this, what do you think of that? So I think, just finding those resources first and foremost. But stopping for a minute as a parent of a newly diagnosed child and not taking it personally and just regrouping. Figuring out, okay, how can I help my child through the school system? Because again youre the expert so you can help them in understanding what your child needs better.

Lisa: Yeah, I think thats so right on. Alright, well, that is all. Is there anything else, questions that I havent asked you or anything else that you want to say before we wrap up?

Cindy: No, I dont think so. But thank you, thank you for having me on here. I treasure your friendship and our relationship when it started was really what I needed to kind of get out of the hole that I was in. So the coaching has definitely helped me and has worked wonders within our household.

Lisa: Well, Im so glad to hear that. I guess on that note, would you recommend coaching with me?

Cindy: Absolutely I would recommend coaching with you. I recommend it all the time.

Lisa: Well, I so appreciate that and I really appreciate all the details that you gave about your experience because I think that so many people can relate to that, especially the taking it personally with our kids who are a little bit more higher functioning who can say things to us that arent the nicest. And especially when it comes to other things too like no property destruction. I remember your favorite lamp or there was a favorite pillow that we talked about at some point. And its hard to separate that. So it really does take practice.

And I think also when youre talking to somebody else, youre telling them and theyre now going, Oh my God, I cant believe that. And theyre like, Yeah, Ive been there. It takes it down a notch.

Cindy: Yeah, it does, it really helps. And its funny, sometimes on that personal piece, I have that lamp, it sits on my desk as a reminder that its not personal, the lamp survived, we survived. It still comes on as broken as it is. So sometimes I really just need to leave the broken lamp out there to remind yourself it wasnt about you. It wasnt even about the lamp.

Lisa: Well, Cindy, again, thank you so much for coming on. Im sure this has been so helpful for so many people and I cannot wait to see you in just two weeks, we will be together at the Coops Troops Retreat.

Cindy: I know, Im excited, I cant wait. Ill give you a big hug.

Lisa: I cant wait. Alright, well, thanks again.

Cindy: Thanks, Lisa, I appreciate it.

Alright, thank you so much for listening. I hope you got tons of value out of Cindys story, and just know, Cindy is not a unicorn and neither am I or any of my clients. This is all possible for you too. To learn more about my coaching program and how I can help you change your parenting experience, schedule a consultation. The link will be in the episode notes and you can always just go right to my website and do it from there. Alright, talk to you next week.

Thanks for listening to The Autism Mom Coach. If you want more information or the show notes and resources from the podcast, visit theautismmomcoach.com. See you next week.